[BASIC/STANDARD] Warcraft: War of the Ancients Mafia - GAME OVER, MAFIA WINS

[Kaylee]

Feel better Wish

[Songstress]

Somewhere in Kalimdor...

 

Krasus awoke with trepidation in a place he felt he should have recognized.  The forest glade was ringed with flowers, and suffused with an expectant stillness.  The red-haired mage, Rhonin, slumbered on peacefully a few yards away, but Krasus had far too much on his mind to rest.

 

Since being pulled into the temporal disturbance in the Stonetalon Mountains, and the horrifying sight of Nozdormu himself trapped in time and struggling to hold together the fabric of reality, of course he had a lot on his mind.  He and the human had been captured by Night Elves shortly after their arrival, Night Elves who were rare indeed in the world he and Rhonin had left.  Until their arrival to aid the Alliance against the Burning Legion in this recent war, most of the scholars and mages he associated with through the Kirin Tor had thought them extinct after....  after.... what was it?  

 

Krasus frowned at this gap in his memory, another sign that all was not well with him since he had been swallowed by the anomaly.  Rhonin had fought powerfully against their captors, to be sure, but his own magic had been terrifyingly weak, and he had inexplicably been unable to shapeshift back to his true form - the red dragon Korialstrasz.

 

He needed answers, and something told him that he could only receive them from the true inhabitant of this glade.

 

Krasus settled himself on the forest floor to wait.  "I would speak with you," his voice rang out, deep and calm.

 

A rustle in the trees at the edge of the glade, and at least one of his questions was answered.  The huge, powerful form that entered the clearing could only be the legendary Cenarius.  But why would the demigod have sent his minions to led the Night Elves astray, and stolen their captives from them?

 

"You and your companion are unknowns to me," Cenarius explained, "and clearly do not belong here.  We would know more of you - who you are, and why you have come.  The Night Elves are arrogant, and believe they have power over things which do not concern them.  It was a simple matter to misdirect and confuse, and to restrain them while you were taken beyond their reach."

 

"I understand how you found us," Krasus allowed, as the demigod had powerful magic and would have known the instant he and Rhonin had invaded his forest. "But it seems the Night Elves were also aware of our presence and had come specifically looking for us.  How is that possible?"

 

Cenarius nodded gravely. "Do not discount the might of Zin-Azshari. The power of the Well of Eternity is at their feet, and they are capable of magics that rival my own."

 

Zin-Azshari?  Krasus was stunned.  Though his long memory had many troubling gaps, the ancient capital city of the Night Elves was something that could not be erased. Zin-Azshari and the Well itself had been destroyed ten thousand years ago in.... in what?  There was that gap again, a blank that he could not fill.  He was the youngest of Alexstrasza's consorts, but Korialstrasz himself was ancient in this world's terms and had lived through this history.

 

All Krasus could recall was that there was a catastrophe of some sort that had nearly wiped out the Night Elves, something significant enough that it was branded in his failing memory.  And he shuddered at the realization that it was very likely to be occurring very soon.

[wish-tree]

Feel better Wish

 

Thank you!

[Cass]

I would actually say Lenlo (I originally just wrote Lenlove? wtf) a little more likely to be town than Shad, due to his willingness to give Shad a town lean like that.

For now..

Lenlo

Shad

Is this a meta thing you have on Lenlo? (Can you explain?)

 

I don't understand how one can be more Town to you when they both committed the same action (calling each other Town).

 

Underlined: I need to go back and look..

Bold: Well it's just an awkward interaction if they were both mafia together and I'm not sure I see either of them deciding to just do that to get town read. More likely v-v but I can see v-w too. Would say right now I'm rating Lenlo a little higher for raisons I can't explain. But Shad also feels different from his start last game and I consider that to be positive as well.

Red: I literally said it wasn't meant to be alignment indicative. I think you're jumping on things that mean pretty much nothing right now FYI Zander has a nice beard.

 

Joking aside though, I don't have to explain every thought that I have on thread because more often than not, they may mean nothing or I have no way to substantiate them at that moment.  When I made the "cute" comment, it was barely pages into the game and nothing was happening, I was hoping for more content by the time I got off of work. I have two 10 minute breaks a night, and one 30 minute lunch, I'm not going to write a whole dialogue to explain myself and my every action. Thems the truths

 

Blue: I wasn't being that serious? Also, refer to the above for why I'm back and forth ^^

 

Thoughts on this:

The (your) bold is basically the conclusion I came to at the beginning of all of this and why your cute comment stood out to me.

I realise you can't always elaborate, but if you don't, or if I see a chance to ask a question that will give me more to work with later, I'll ask. I was/am/will jump on anything and everything I think I can get people to talk about. Most of the time the things I'm jumping on are pretty much nothing and that's fine. They may not even be/end up being as interesting as Zander's beard but it doesn't really matter. It's more about getting players to elaborate/talk more so that i) opinions are on record and ii) I can get a better feel for tone, their motivation and whether I believe what they're saying is more likely to come from Scum or Town - especially this early in the game.

 

I still don't like that you didn't give more than cute for the initial observation, or that the reason you gave for reading Lenlo a higher Town read than Shad was first 'due to his willingness to give Shad a town lean like that' when they both 'gave a town lean like that' at the very same time and secondly 'raisons you can't explain'. Maybe nothing, maybe something, definitely too early for me to make a call.

 

Tone sounds you, fwiw.

 

 

 

@ Cass, I would say that Lenlo posting in that manner is completely null for him (1). Also too early for it to mean anything about Shad as they were basically the only two in thread at that time (2).

 

Ty! (*Numbers added to points for reference)

1) What differences would you expect from Lenlo as either alignment? 

2) Do you have a read on either?

 

I can believe Lenlo's tone is null, given my complete and utter misread of him in Diabolo. But still, this post stood out:

I think this is the post you're referring to Cass? Or was there another one?

 

Also, what experience do you have with Shad?

 

I've read and re-read the quotes but I don't know what you're referring to with the bold lol Halp?

 

I have no experience with Shad IIRC. Why?

[Cass]

Okay, hi peoples

 

Am feeling pretty sick, and am in two other games, plus trying to fill signups for my own game. These are mere excuses for lack of content, but yeah, this game was not my priority yesterday.

 

I am going back and gonna do what I do best - initial reads.

 

Will try to solve this within the first 10 pages, tyvm.

 

Feel better Lenn  

[Askthepizzaguy]

 

@ wish-tree

 

That's valid, but do you think that's what Shad has been doing all round? Or most of it, or is his main motivation so far today?

 

I hadn't gotten that impression. What do you see when you look beyond that one post?

 

Keep in mind it was page 1. There will be a lot of posts on page 1 and many of the early pages which lack a motive. Most of the first few pages are garbage posts.

 

I read them anyway just in case. Shad was an exception to my usual nulls that early.

 

Non-bold is fine and the sort of thing I'd say is generally more likely Town. IMO it comes from Pizza in any alignment [ ] .

 

Bold is weird filler, Pizza.

 

No, it was part of the point I was making.

 

It's one thing to consider whether a post lacks a wolfy motive (or a town one for that matter) but in this specific case it's important to note that this behavior was occurring within the first 20 posts of the game.

 

Not enough has happened yet in the game for a wolf to have a particularly wolfy motivation.

 

It actually lessens the weight of my original point, which is that I thought Shad had no specific plan, lie, or manipulation in mind when he wrote that post, which makes it less likely to be something he generated from a wolfy mindset. That's mitigated by the fact that it's page 1.

 

Essentially, what I'm saying is that my original idea is valid, but it's less reliable because page 1.

 

So it's crucial to the thought I was trying to convey, not filler. Please check the context of that conversation, see for yourself.

[wish-tree]

(edit: fixed spoiler tags)

pg. 1-4, part 1:

 

Because I know how to read Penny (Celeste), though she kind of lacks content, it can be safe to say she's town. I've explained before.

 

So far, judging by the first page:

 

Shad, Laine looking good.

 

Cass, Zander, slight town.

 

Lenlo, Turin, null to possibly scummy.

 

(these are not my final reads, but my initial reads are often correct, so please don't bypass this). 

 

Also, I had to reduce the emoticons because Zander and Laine and Cass posted too many. XD

 

 

 

haha

 

I almost want to legit town read you for saying that when I did.

 

Past the entire does Shad have meta on Lenlo thing, which was a bit null, this post is just kinda cute. I actually think this is rather natural and jokey, which I think is right coming from what I've seen of Shad's town game. First impression - good? 

 

 

haha

 

I almost want to legit town read you for saying that when I did.

Lets take this game by storm, me and you against the world.

 

 

Lenlo feels a little more guarded, as this statement is obviously not meant to be taken seriously. 

 

Also before I head to bed [v]Cass[/v]

 

Normal for her town game. Casual, as I've explained before. Also, Lenlo, as for why I didn't speak up to defend Cass, I was spending time with my family and organizing clothes... so I couldn't exactly post,

 

 

Also before I head to bed [v]Cass[/v]

checking in at break to lol at this, purely because Cass' ability to rand mafia hehehehehe

Shad/Lenlo being cute

 

 

First (?) post from Laine. I like it, though I've learned it's null so far because of her ability to be laidback as scum (buddied me too!).

 

 

[v]Penny![/v]

 

LOVELY PEOPLE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I. AM. TOWN !!!!!!!! 

 

And I have permission/instruction from Cory to go #FULLCASS!!

 

[snipped emoticons]

 

Ooooooohhhh Wiiiiiilllllvvvveessssss.....

 

Watchyo back!

 

Hyperactive Cass, overly excited. Seems towny. At first in other games I was wary of town-reading her, because I tend to find excitement rather contrived, but it's kind of her modus operandi.

Cass, on 03 Jan 2016 - 02:34 AM, said:

lol I'll see if I can stay awake!! *bounces*

 

confirmation of the whole hyper, lightfree thing she's got going

good morning

 

What is it about a simple smile that feels forced or genuine?. This post, however, tells me nothing, because it doesn't make sense to read someone based off a smile.

 

 

 

 

Shad/Lenlo being cute

 

 

Current thoughts on these two are that there's ?probably too much interaction and Town-Town calling there for them to be W-W. Lenlo possibly a more likely candidate for non-Town (but this with full disclosure that I'm reading Lenlo much the same as everything I read of his in the Diablo game and he flipped Town).

 

@Laine, can you explain 'being cute' and why it was important to you? Ie - what's your assessment of the cuteness in relation to initial reads?

 

 

 

I like the bolded part at this point in the game, but the underlined part feels like a stretch to me. Don't really like it.

 

I'm pretty sure Laine at this point means that it was just a cute thing... And to single this interaction out instead of Laine's earlier comment on Cass randing wolf, which was also done jokingly, doesn't make much sense to me.

 

I'm slightly wary of Alanna right now...

 

Lainey, you a wolf?

 

Wot

Don't think I've seen her jump on someone this early in any other town games.

 

I guess I could chalk it up to Cass being overexcited about this game, but actually, Lainey looks better than Cass atm in terms of naturalness and tone. 

SWEEEEET RANDED TOWN AGAIN!!!!!

 

As I said before, excitement always reads scummy to me, so I'm going to have to withhold judgement. Otherwise, the tone would feel kind of fake to me.

 

Also, to clarify your question about why I say that I like using my brain versus using tone/gut -- it makes more sense logically to use my brain, but honestly, both are factored in if I use my intuition. Intuition is just harder to explain -- and that should probably give you an indication as to why. (And I'm pretty sure I answered this question already, even if in a different way. Please read, since it makes me annoyed that you aren't, and I honestly don't think it's fair to scum read you because you're ignoring posts that would explain the questions you ask about other posts.)

 

 

@ Cass, I would say that Lenlo posting in that manner is completely null for him. Also too early for it to mean anything about Shad as they were basically the only two in thread at that time.

 

I think this consideration is fair, too. I do agree that if you were to read into it, though, Lenlo would come out slightly scummier. Looking good for Turin, because at least on a surface level, I agree with him.

 

Shad, please attempt to describe your take on Lenlo's meta.

Also, Cass, who is Penny?

 

Okay, both questions are rather null. I'd think they'd be important to ask regardless of alignment.

 

 

Only players in this game I feel I have a pretty solid grasp of meta on.

 

It's going to be fun playing with so many unfamiliar faces.  A different sort of challenge than I've gotten used to.

 

 

Just Lunch The Wolves imo!!!!!!!!

 

kind of completely ignores the comment and just does his own thing. Shows no concern for self-image. I kind of like it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Only players in this game I feel I have a pretty solid grasp of meta on.

 

It's going to be fun playing with so many unfamiliar faces.  A different sort of challenge than I've gotten used to.

You have a solid grasp of my meta? Do tell, its always fun hearing what others think.

 

 

 

First ya Id like to hear your thoughts on Len's Meta.....and mine as well!!!!!!

 

 

Okay, good question to ask Shad, who even might not have been serious on the meta thing or just exaggerated.

 

 

[v]Penny![/v]

 

LOVELY PEOPLE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

I. AM. TOWN !!!!!!!! 

 

And I have permission/instruction from Cory to go #FULLCASS!!

 

[snipped emoticons]

 

Ooooooohhhh Wiiiiiilllllvvvveessssss.....

 

Watchyo back!

 

 

Cass I have no Meta on you...is joke votes normal for you?  How do you play?  What are your scum tells???  Or is it just straight Rand.Org has forever branded you a Wolf??!!!

 

lmklmklmk

 

 

This seems fairly aggressive. It seems that he's taking a very leadery, solvey position, which adds townie points in my estimation.

 

 

 

 

good morning

Morning Turin havent played with you in a long time or really much at all for that matter looking forward to it man!!!!

it has been a while. let's lunch some wolves.

 

 

The Turin reply feels a bit unnatural and stiff at best. 

 

 

Turin have you played with Cass??

 

Like do you have any Meta on her?

 

Im a pretty heavy Meta reliant player so I need some info on her.

 

Okay. I'm similar, actually. I'd prefer to read people off of Meta (changed a lot from my last game, I know, I know :P). But I can go without, as Cass mentioned. Just had some reservations. 

 

Also a little on yourself would be pretty ok.

 

 

Others will weigh in on both but I do like hearing people describe themselves tho.

 

Read above! (even though this isn't directed at me).

 

 

[wish-tree]

Part 2:

 

 

 

Z, I think I played once or twice with her in the game. I don't recall a lot about her but I think she is a more analytical player. I recall dice always having to tell her to go to sleep.

For me, I'm Turin and I like lazy Sunday mornings in bed, medium sized walks in the park and living here in the shire.

I'm town. Like always.

 

Lol. I like most of this except for the bolded part. But it's not too bad -- my opinion is probably influenced by the post of his I just commented on.

 

 

Shad/Lenlo being cute

Current thoughts on these two are that there's ?probably too much interaction and Town-Town calling there for them to be W-W. Lenlo possibly a more likely candidate for non-Town (but this with full disclosure that I'm reading Lenlo much the same as everything I read of his in the Diablo game and he flipped Town).
 
@Laine, can you explain 'being cute' and why it was important to you? Ie - what's your assessment of the cuteness in relation to initial reads?

Why Lenlo over Shad? Shad can play a good wolf game and Lenlo is pretty null so far.
 
The being cute joke comment was saying that they're being really chummy. It wasn't meant to indicate alignments of either, but it is good to note for later in case one of them flips.
 

I'm slightly wary of Alanna right now...
 
Lainey, you a wolf?

Yo! Cass, calm yourself. I'm not a wolf. Why are you wary of me?
 
 

 

Checking in, will be online after work, looking forward to some content by then to look over

 Lock Clear!!!!!!!
[snipped emoticons]

Hi dahhlingggg!   

 

For Zander:

 

 

 Don't think you can lock clear me as a pocketing technique though. I'm watching you, Z.

 

 

 

This looks good from Lainey. Seems carefree, isn't too worried that Cass is calling her a wolf. 

 

 

[wish-tree]

 

Okay, hi peoples

 

Am feeling pretty sick, and am in two other games, plus trying to fill signups for my own game. These are mere excuses for lack of content, but yeah, this game was not my priority yesterday.

 

I am going back and gonna do what I do best - initial reads.

 

Will try to solve this within the first 10 pages, tyvm.

 

Feel better Lenn  

 

ty

[wish-tree]

 

 

@ wish-tree

 

That's valid, but do you think that's what Shad has been doing all round? Or most of it, or is his main motivation so far today?

 

I hadn't gotten that impression. What do you see when you look beyond that one post?

 

Keep in mind it was page 1. There will be a lot of posts on page 1 and many of the early pages which lack a motive. Most of the first few pages are garbage posts.

 

I read them anyway just in case. Shad was an exception to my usual nulls that early.

 

Non-bold is fine and the sort of thing I'd say is generally more likely Town. IMO it comes from Pizza in any alignment [ ] .

 

Bold is weird filler, Pizza.

 

No, it was part of the point I was making.

 

It's one thing to consider whether a post lacks a wolfy motive (or a town one for that matter) but in this specific case it's important to note that this behavior was occurring within the first 20 posts of the game.

 

Not enough has happened yet in the game for a wolf to have a particularly wolfy motivation.

 

It actually lessens the weight of my original point, which is that I thought Shad had no specific plan, lie, or manipulation in mind when he wrote that post, which makes it less likely to be something he generated from a wolfy mindset. That's mitigated by the fact that it's page 1.

 

Essentially, what I'm saying is that my original idea is valid, but it's less reliable because page 1.

 

So it's crucial to the thought I was trying to convey, not filler. Please check the context of that conversation, see for yourself.

 

 

Hmm... when I look for wolves in the first few pages, I don't look for motive. I look for things being off, like a post sounding very structured/contrived. I've found that townies put less effort into openings than scum do.

[Celeste]

 

 

I have a question for all of you

 

You are on the side of a road walking down the sidewalk.

You have a gun with 1 bullet in it.

Two people are walking towards you.

The one on your left has a baseball bat the other is wearing a cowboy hat.

Who do you shoot?

 

Umm what does this prove Nolder? Seems like pointless WIFOM.

 

Uhhh, Penny? Your Tone has changed :P

 

Last game Penny asked random entry question thing like this herself when Town.

 

I have no problem her questioning Nolder/stating it seems like WIFOM.

 

The Umm is unnecessary to the question and a change in style/tone from last game.

I forgot about the question at first and don't really understand why it is being asked. I read the other answers first but it just seems like WIFOM.

[Celeste]

Also Nolders absence is long since his last post.

[Celeste]

 

 

 

 

 

I have a question for all of you

 

You are on the side of a road walking down the sidewalk.

You have a gun with 1 bullet in it.

Two people are walking towards you.

The one on your left has a baseball bat the other is wearing a cowboy hat.

Who do you shoot?

 

Umm what does this prove Nolder? Seems like pointless WIFOM.

 

 

Well... There's one post I can't read into.

XD

 

 

 

 

 

also, can someone explain to me what the entire note taking thing was about anyway? I don't see how that generated reads at all, if it did.

 

 

Wasn't meant to, it was me sharing a website that I find useful for generating a list of numbers which I use when keeping track of my reads.

 

Not every post is explicitly for finding scum. Most of them should be.

I actually disagree, somewhat. I think you can read a lot into one post, even about things that are unrelated.

Hmm... Can you give me a rundown of Lenlo's meta? Don't recall.

And Lenlo, I want you to describe Pizza's meta to me as well. Ty!

I refuse. Why? Because I feel like being difficult. Actual reason? I cant. He just feels the same as previous games. Im not the kind of player who can put that into words.

 

@Lenbot, I'm tone reading you too guarded :P. Please elaborate your thoughts more/get actual opinions of posts on the record if you haven't already. Go out on a limb. 

I'm ok with you Town reading me to some extent here because Snakes reads. I can follow your logic wrt Penny and somewhat agree. BUT I feel like if you're scum you would have to make these two particular reads or be called out.

 

I want to see you bring something else to the table and actually give an opinion. You weren't shy giving reads about players you didn't know in the DT, why are you holding yourself back here?

 

1. What do you disagree with?

2. Did you get any reads/leans out of any of this whole situation?

 

@Lenlo

Which games? What alignment?

 

 

Lenlo's meta I am still working on. I don't even think I had a specific reason for finding him scum when I did in that game he was actually scum in, I just got my attention put there probably by Zander his wolf-mate and then agreed it wasn't strikingly townie.

 

Sometimes wolves will help you find other wolves. For whatever purpose, it's still a dead wolf when you lynch that guy.

 

His town game I hope I'm getting a better feel of after last game, but he wasn't strictly a townie in the game prior and I had very conflicted reads on him and even said "serial killer" was a likely alignment for his third party survivor with killing power.... role... thing.

 

So basically I need to see more Lenlo. Last game gave me some, but he was under the gun for being weird for most of D1, and the game moved too fast for him to generate much content after that.

 

So I don't have much "normal" Lenlo meta.

 

 

How was Lenlo's content in the scum game when it got busy? Same problem?

 

@Kaylee roping you in here - is content level any sort of tell for Lenlo?

 

 

If a wolf is particularly bussy (as I sometimes am in the mid-game, or at least D2 onward) then they have that perfect info of who is a wolf.

 

Then they'll make cases on wolves and say why they're scummy.

 

It's a great help. It's like when you're trying to infiltrate a terrorist cell and they tell you all about a rival terrorist cell that they know about because they're also a terrorist.

 

Can't discount the excellent work wolves do in destroying other wolves. Especially if they're bussing. Man, that's a great help.

 

 

I absolutely cannot tell what the motivation is behind this and that feels deliberate. No idea if it's alignment indicative with Pizza having only seen him Scum, but these are the sort of posts that gave me scum feels on him last game. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

With that said, bye. *poofs*

Another tell for Celeste being town is her scum reading me. That's something I expect, because she's a lot more uncertain of herself as town and also absolutely can't read me. ;)

 

this is not true all the time and you know it.

 

Do you believe, even if it is inaccurate, that this is her honest opinion? You're saying she's remembering incorrectly or is lying deliberately or neither.

I believe this is her honest opinion despite forgetting that simple fact.

I want to know what you think of me, actually. And since I trust you so far, I would also like your gut reads.

(What works, works. Meh.)

 

 

I think your slight town so far. Although I have my reservations. Cass as slight town too. Shad feels iffy to me a bit. I want to hear more from Laine.

 

Penn

1. Why does Shad feel iffy?

2. Why Laine/what are you waiting for?

1. I stated it later in thread.

2. I was scum once with Laine in TUS and feel like I can read her well.

[Zander?]

 

 

I'm painfully chewing through a Zander-only read of Belichick.

 

Absorbed: Not much.

 

He uses the word gross a lot

 

He is constantly defending townies for no real reason, generally being combative, disagreeable a lot, and yet +1s a lot of comments. Essentially he's just generating noise and attempting to replicate townie enthusiasm in a generic way.

 

His casing is sloppy as hell and it's getting people to notice that what he's saying isn't based on any sort of fact.

 

It's a lot of emotion and I like this and I don't like that and confrontationalism and townie cheerleading but it's all on the surface.

 

There's no real soul or paranoia to his game there.

 

That's my summary of Belichick so far, by page 35. It's just his D1 stuff.

 

The worrisome part is that a lot of what I'm seeing in this game gives me a similarly null impression. Like there was nothing in Zander's game in Belichick that I would have thought was overtly scummy.... or even that much of a town tell other than his general enthusiasm levels which we know now are exactly null.

 

But, there are some clear differences.

 

I'm noting the constant superlatives are not happening this game, he doesn't say gross a lot. And there's not as ostentatious town-like showboating.

 

I did notice Zander actually checked into the thread before doing reads to catch up in Belichick and that his catch ups just seemed to be mostly filler and pushing/defending, rather than substance.

 

With that in mind, chewing through another read of Zander.

 

 

 

So what did you glean from all that?

[Lenlo]

So I found my solution to deal with my Laine misunderstanding last night.

 

Accept it and if at any point I learn she is lying to me, go full Eldrick on her.

[Zander?]

 

@ Shad dude wth are you seeing with Csarmi man???!!!  I dont get it....I mean not just a Town read but YOUR TOP TOWN READ???!!!?!?!?!?  WTF

 

And also Alanna has your scummiest is also pretty bad imo.

 

Sorry brother not seeing either of those like at all!!!!!

 

Blue, consider it a call for the rest of you to town harder.

 

Red, my scum order was borderline arbitrary except for Turin being the least bad of the four, and I posted that prior to/still haven't finished absorbing Laine's most recent catch-up post(s?).

 

 

 

BLUE:  Shad ok MAYBE you see something I dont.....but you damn well know NOBODY Towns harder then I do!!!

 

RED: No real scum reads at all then?  Is that what youre getting at with that?

[Shad_]

I just got caught up for a minute. I have few minutes right now while tidying the house. I will respond to Shad's last post first. Then if have time will go back and respond to Laine and some other things I noticed.

 

First off the jokey interaction from the both of you had nothing to do with my vote. It was completely to do with your coming out and stating that you had something to read Len by but then refusing to elaborate. False promises (to me) are something more likely to come from mafia than town. You call it lazy I call it simple. Maybe I am too "shallow" for you but it is my experience that mafia will do whatever they think can help them win. sometimes they will even do things in early game that are nothing more than a tweak at the town. I have done it. Len has done it. I would be surprised if you haven't done it.

 

You say you don't know if it is dishonest but you don't think it is honest. This is a nudge. Make a choice. Take a stand. change it later if you think it is justified. You say you don't like it but imo your reasoning is a bunch of doubletalk. Again this is more likely to come from mafia than town.

Why did you single out Lenlo rather than asking me to explain Zander, Nolder, and Laine as well?

 

Why is my indecisiveness concerning your alignment prior to engaging you a scum tell? Traditionally speaking, I would think it's more likely for a wolf to to draw conclusions from a distance and avoid feeling their targets out than to express doubts and start asking questions to resolve them.  Would you agree with this?  If you don't think the latter is what's happening here, what gives you the impression that this is all for show?

 

Your argument is pretty straight-forward.  "Shad said X, but he couldn't show X, so he's a liar."  I'm sure that's how you tick, to an extent, or you would look drastically different in this game and players who know you would be hounding you for it.  The problem is that this is an intensely easy out for a wolf.  What you have to demonstrate for me is that you've put some thought into it.  Surely you have, if you really believe I am a wolf and want to convince the rest of the village of this.  Forget the basic formula 'said x didn't do x = wolf' and give me a more contextual take on what happened here.  I said I read Lenlo well.  I think I do.  I was asked to teach everyone else how to read Lenlo in the absence of in-game content.  I can't.  I explained this in excessive detail.  You remained at said x didn't do x.  This shows a lack of desire to think, which is less likely to come from a town player who wants to win than from a scum player trying to skate by.  If you are town, you must respond to the changing circumstances.  You don't have to conclude that I am anything but filthy, awful scum, but you have to evolve beyond essentially page 1 content and explain why my answer last night is wolfy.  If you cannot do this, it is my job to lynch you.

[Zander?]

 

 

#401 Zander are you scum reading Celeste becasue of her unvote? (this is answered later, followup below)

 

This is good though, bring on the pain.

 

I need it to be page 45 when I wake up. Make it happen Zander / Shad / Laine

Oops! I'm barely caught up to here! LOL Also, I work 6pm to 5am EST so probably not going to be very active at those times

Don't remember very much from Kaylee besides the Celeste unvote and Zander's Frozen comments...

 

 

=_= Aye aye this is ridiculous since your basing it off of the timing of taking off a joke vote? That is super poor reasoning Zander imo.

 

 

About as ridiculous as you thinking just because I mix up your very similar RL's names I dont know who Im talking about....???!!!

 

Also im feeling there is some poss w/w equity between you both atp.  I mean its not like youve done anything up to this point that would lead me to believe that you are Town.  Also it doesnt hurt Pizza whose prolly my best Town read thus far feels the same.

 

fwiw I feel worse about Lenny (WIsh) then you atp.

I agree with you on Celeste here but I would definitely put Wish above her purely because of how Wish came into the game and started actively hunting.

I don't hate #433 from Kaylee

 

 

I dunno. I havnt paid to much attention to them cause ive been busy, cleaning sunday and all. Their interplay is weird though. Like playing off/defending each other, in a game about trust and finding bad guys. Its something id expect to see from teammates/masons/hydras. They arnt a hydra and there arnt masons in a standard setup.

I got that too when Wish jumped in to answer for Celeste. Seems almost like there's a knowing. I could be reading too much into that though.

 

As far as this is concerned, Len/Penny often play as a hydra so I think they're in a habit of defending each other. I'm not sure I would necessarily draw sure alignments from that.

#449 Overly defensive from Celeste

 

 

I hope you can read Csarmi cause I tend to not understand what he talks about and find him inherently scummy like in Star Wars.

Salami feels towny to me even when he's peeked scum.  I have zero confidence in my ability to read him atp in my experience with him (2 games?), but he did one of those universal SSoHW things that has always lead to a correct read so far.

 

I won't be shocked if he's scum, but I'll be a bit startled.

 

Don't like this reasoning from Shad to give Csarmi top town read, but we'll go with it.

 

[v]Celeste[/v]

I don't hate this.

 

 

Bold: Well it's just an awkward interaction if they were both mafia together and I'm not sure I see either of them deciding to just do that to get town read. More likely v-v but I can see v-w too. Would say right now I'm rating Lenlo a little higher for raisons I can't explain. But Shad also feels different from his start last game and I consider that to be positive as well.

Last game I was extremely sick and so was my kid, and I was obligated to spend a lot of time visiting family anyway. If I'd randed town I might have seriously considered requesting a sub. You should probably rely on your broader experience with my scum game to read me.

 

I feel like this is a slap on the wrist from you Shad. You've actually felt pretty involved this game and that's a good look, but I need to look back at Pulp Fiction because I remember this nagging feeling.

#496 I actually think I followed through with this more recently, Shad.

#501 Zander's reads list. Would have Kaylee lower, at least. Wish higher.

 

 

 

At Alanna 2 things:

 

First Im not trying to tell you what to do at all my dear.   But i find it really hard to respond to these long posts as they are.  Can you at least maybe if you have something addressed to me just use the regular posts so I can respond to it please?

 

And Im fine where I have Kay and Penny where they are.  I mean especially Wish.  What are you seeing differently them I am?

[Zander?]

So afew things to say in regards to my vote.

 

3 people, Pizza I believe, Celeste and Wish-Tree, ignored it completely.

 

1 Person, Laine, acknowledged it but didnt question it. Just said they didnt hate it.

 

2 people, Zander and Kaylee, saw my vote and asked for reasons before backing off when I said I would give them later.

 

I expected Celeste to ignore it. I expected Zander to question it. I didnt expect Pizza to not lambaste me or question me over it. Didnt expect WishTree to ignore it. Dont know how I feel about Laine saying she doesnt hate it, basically endorsing it, when I havnt explained it at all.

 

 

So Len what was your take from each persons reaction?

[Lenlo]

Im still hoping Wish catchs up to it, but im considering the possibility that she has already caught up to it and may just be ignoring it.

[Zander?]

My list looks something like this... ?

Alanna

Lenlo

Zander

Pizza

Shad

Cass

Wish

 

Csarmi

Pral

Nolder

 

Celeste

Kaylee

Turin

 

 

 

ALANNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNAAAA!!!!

 

<3 <3 <3

 

Dont put your own name on your reads lists!!!!

 

What is it about Penny you find that makes her more scummy then Lenny?

 

Can you provide some reasons behind your reads please?

[Shad_]

 

 

@ Shad dude wth are you seeing with Csarmi man???!!!  I dont get it....I mean not just a Town read but YOUR TOP TOWN READ???!!!?!?!?!?  WTF

 

And also Alanna has your scummiest is also pretty bad imo.

 

Sorry brother not seeing either of those like at all!!!!!

 

Blue, consider it a call for the rest of you to town harder.

 

Red, my scum order was borderline arbitrary except for Turin being the least bad of the four, and I posted that prior to/still haven't finished absorbing Laine's most recent catch-up post(s?).

 

 

 

BLUE:  Shad ok MAYBE you see something I dont.....but you damn well know NOBODY Towns harder then I do!!!

 

RED: No real scum reads at all then?  Is that what youre getting at with that?

 

 

Weird pop-in.  Red, I count four.  Where did this question come from?

 

Blue, then convince me?

 

Frankly I'm tripped out by the disorganization in this villa.  Maybe it's a consequence of town coming together pretty strong in our last three games vs a lot of unfamiliar faces here giving everyone the willies.  Pizza's inability to reach a resolution on you has had me second-guessing myself all game and I don't know if there's something different about him or if you're a little off this game and we're both seeing it.  I don't have any compelling reason to think you're scum, I'm just not seeing super-obvious town Zander yet.  (Is part of that also colored by my decision to hard-clear you out the gate when I was scum last game?  Maybe.  You might not have been as obvious in that game as I let myself believe, since I wasn't trying to figure you out and had no incentive to fabricate uncertainty.)

[Zander?]

 

 

#232 Wish- like that she's giving reads and explaining herself. Expected her to come out more and , maybe if she was mafia, in an attempt to cover herself like she did in TUS where she was super flirty. Even if I didn't remember how she was in TUS d1, her TOANNN seems to be good. Would put her above Celeste, who I currently have as nullish.

Yes!  I wouldn't say "flirty" but I remember scum!Wish being really playful and jokey in TUS, far moreso than here.

I was on her team. She was being intentionally flirty to not be outted. Hence why I used "flirty"

 

Alanna you know I love ya but that answer makes me both uneasy and sad.....

Why?

 

 

 

You should know why......

[Zander?]

Look into these eyes Laine. Look into the eyes of Jay Leno and tell him you are town. Can you do that? Are you capable of lying to Jay Leno?

 

 

We cant see the eyes cause the worlds 2ND greatest chin (Clov chin OBV GOAT <3!!!!) is blocking them!!!!!

 

lolololololol

[csarmi]

Umm. Anything going on? Kind of 2015 for me yet.