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Medieval Mayhem (SCA and other medieval related chatter)


LadyWordsmith

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Hi! Since it was suggested (and requested) that we go ahead and have a thread devoted to the SCA and medieval related conversations, I thought I would go ahead and start that so it does not continue to eat up the 'Weekend Plans' thread! 

 

The conversation started on the other thread began with a discussion of choosing personas and costume choices. So we can start there, or with any question or comments anyone wishes to offer up. :smile: 

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For garb?  Start simple.  Find a picture or an illustration of an outfit you like and build it but it isn't going to happen overnight.  There are places like Garb the World which sell complete outfits for newcomers and other merchants will "pair" items that look good together as an ensemble.  For instance, Chivalry Sports/Renstore recommends which garments of theirs go with what, where and how.  This has been helpful for me in the past.

 

So, let's break Min down.  I'm going to try to do with without favoring one merchant over another.

min_zps4fb82efd.jpg

Her top is a collared shirt paired with a doublet/jacket sort of deal.

So, we can find collared shirts easily enough.

collaredshirt_zpscf61a509.jpg

But there's no way we can stuff those billowing sleeves into that jacket, so you're going to look at something more like a Jacobite shirt.

jacobite_zps45d6e86a.jpg

It's a similar profile and the sleeves are much more manageable.  Remove the lacing.

The outerwear (I still can't decide if it's a jacket or a doublet) is next.

 

GB0173_doublet_zps4bcb7e7a.jpg

This particular doublet is made by Get Dressed for Battle.  I own one of these in black wool and they're nice.  Nothing fancy, really.  The ties were unusual and I actually only need three.  You should see what they did with the matching pants, tho.  Good grief.  o.o

The bottom is much easier for Min - any pair of slacks tucked into a pair of boots will do.  Pants with a little more material will gather and poof above the knees while slim pants will pretty much stay where you put them.  I go either way depending on my needs: fighting in loose pants is infinitely more comfortable than tight.

I haven't done much with belts and this doublet but any belt you wear is much more comfortable underneath it.  Wrap it around your waist but let the doublet fall over.  A belt pouch and dagger can follow but having those underneath might be a little weird.

Ultimately, it's cheaper by far to make something than to buy it and the social gathering is always nice.  Bring a picture of what you'd like to a sewing circle and they could point you in the right direction for patterns.  I like http://www.reconstructinghistory.com/ - she has great patterns but they are pricey at $30 a pop.  AND NEVER EVER EVER EVER (no,  not even now) CUT THE ORIGINAL.  I can handle cutting a $5 pattern but it felt like I was slicing up a book into little giblets at that price.  Who counts rice grains and pennies? This guy.

Does that help at all?

Edited by Wren of the Brown
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Ryrin, if you like the bottom of those three, may I recommend considering mid-late Italian rapier gear? A doublet over that would be comfortable and look great. 

 

I am taking cues for that off a Dona we have in kingdom who is one of the few ladies I know here who dresses nearly always in pants. :smile: 

 

I have seen this look both sleeveless and with sleeves. The example below is one with sleeves (and closed). I have also seen it worn with one that laces down the front like a bodice (not too tightly), and without the sleeves for warmer weather. 

 

I could not find pictures of her 'fancier' gear. But I have noted that she often swaps the top portion out for a skirt separate at times, and thus it is also multi-functional. 

3915978759_bf23d49900.jpg

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Noted! I shall hunt for looser looks. :smile: 

 

It is often a simple enough matter of sizing to your preference with many types of clothing and looking at variations on styles on patterns. Some medieval outfits 'look' like they'd be constrictive or tight, but prove otherwise in the wearing when built to fit the person wearing them (the joy of not buying ready-made clothes is the custom tailoring!). 

 

The item she is wearing (for example) is of less flowy fabric and is certainly more structured than the pretty white shirt, but is not a tight or restrictive garment since she has to be able to fight in it. It is likely to fit similarly to the Min jacket in the image above in wear, though probably looser. 

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My advice, being a newbie?  Get what you can as cheap as you can. Don't worry about matching a persona or time period (no one checks you!), get what's comfortable and still "period." My example? My persona is a 14th century mostly Celtic (father is English, I can get away with a lot that way) woman living in Southern England. I made myself a T-Tunic, & bought some light cotton garb from Camelot's Closet on Ebay. I have enough garb to get through a week of war (which is the drastic end of what you need. If you keep it to small events, enough for two days is PLENTY). My next piece is going to be this dress from the horrible version of King Arthur with Kiera Knightly in it. Ignore the movie, focus on the dress:

 

keiraknightley2.jpg

 

Why? because it's freakin' hot in in the South and layers aren't something I'm terribly interested in until it cools off some! I'm making my girls Roman dresses because they are square, light, and easy to make! 

 

 

Once you have that, you can focus on what you want. I'm going to work on Tudor when it cools off some! :) 

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Entirely agreed! My garb closet has quite a mix of 'it was affordable and easy to make' in my closet, including a wide range of t-tunics and sideless surcoats (which you can make entirely by changing about three lines on my t-tunic pattern!). I also have a viking tunic I bought at an event, clean but used. :grins: 

 

Also, my Tudor wedding dress....was only 'one' layer, because I was not crazy enough to wear three in the Oklahoma summer heat! (It looks like more, but it's not. We cheated). It also has no wool on it...anywhere! I tend to make almost everything out of linen (or a good linen blend, since those are way cheaper than real linen). 

 

Only now, sixteen years into the SCA, do I really have much garb that actually matches my persona by country 'and' period (and much of it is currently in pattern-and-fabric piles in my living room as this summer's projects). 

 

 

And that dress looks awesome :biggrin: 

Edited by LadyWordsmith
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It isn't limited to strictly medieval history. There is a lot of variety out there. I know more than a few Halstatt personas and, hell, one of our knights out here plays an Amerindian who went back to Europe with Columbus. I really dig the early period and off-the-beaten-track stuff At some point, I'd like to make a Tocharian kit.

 

Don't be fooled. We say medieval but we really mean awesome.

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The SCA's purpose/goal is recreating the best and most interesting parts of the middle ages...minus the realities of plagues, serfdom, lack of social mobility, and 'traditional gender roles.' The game would be no fun if we all couldn't take part equally. The structure also allows for the fact you're going to have 1100s Vikings who marry 1400s Englishwomen (and so on, just for one example). But the recreation of the dream is set in a loosely structured game. The structure itself is not something that existed in the middle ages in its complete accuracy, because it would be unfair to various demographics of players. (Kings are chosen in tournaments by right of arms (in most kingdoms this is every 6 months. Not sure if that's all of them yet). They don't just 'stay king until they get old and die' for example.) 

 

It's also not nearly as strict as Reenactment groups regarding 'everything has to be exactly made out of the right materials and in medieval methods'.... because really, most people can't afford that, and this game is not about having money, it's about having fun while enjoying everything cool the period has to offer (and really, the time span runs from ancient to late renaissance if you are looking for a persona now. I know Romans and Greeks as much as I know early Musketeers, as well as medieval Japanese and Korean personas). 

 

Which isn't to say we don't have members who could walk right back into a high medieval setting and probably be perfectly believable and the locals would hardly notice differences, but we also have plenty of children and poor-college-students running around in t-tunics just having a good time 'doing.' 

 

Actually, that's what attracted me to the SCA, personally. The 'Doing.' I wasn't watching someone else perform for people... I was getting to DO things, learn them, and not to 'perform for an audience' but because I could BE a Bard, an Illuminator of medieval manuscripts, the steward of a Feast Kitchen preparing an amazing meal for 150 people. To watch the epic charge of thousands of armored combatants as they clash upon the field; hear the creak of armor, the crash of swords on helms, the bellows of war chants and beating of drums. And sitting around the fire in the evening, listening to a norse scald tell epic tales of the Gods and the mysteries of dragons. Or learning metalwork, or how to build functional full-size trebuchets (that can actually be used in a siege against a castle). 

I am aware it's not for everyone, and that's okay!

However, it allows me (personal testimonial and opinion) to live out a most wonderful fantasy in ways that no RPG, video game, or LARP has ever done (and I do enjoy those as well). And it is where I have found some of my deepest friendships with the kindred of souls (there is so much concentrated Geekdom amongst our people) with whom I have so much in common. Outside of meetings, we're just as likely to be hanging out watching Sci-fi/Fantasy movies, going to Cons ('running' Cons), discussing the latest science fiction, fantasy, mystery, adventure (you name it) novel... or writing them, given the authors and singers amongst the group. And that's only the short portion since if I started listing geeky fandoms it would hit 'all of them.' ((I use the word geek here in the proud sense...such as Think Geek)). It was very convenient to find the majority of my interests represented in one group that brought all of them together in one place. :smile: And not so surprising, since this is the basis and inspiration from which we were given the origins of the wondrous realm of the modern fantasy genre. 

Long happy-babble answer that basically agrees with Hiarthbeorn. :biggrin:  

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I wish I could join the SCA but I'd have to do it with someone and alas I don't have anyone who lives near me who'd want to do it. I'm not much of a lady and i'm having issues finding Bodices and skirts etc that fit me. (I lost a lot of weight so the stuff I have doesn't fit anymore.) Any ideas for good places to find bodices, underclothes etc? Or patterns either way. 

 

What shoes do you guys wear? I need sturdy shoes too. *laughs* 

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For shoes, I wear two different kinds.  When I'm fighting, I wear a tall pair of boots that have sturdy ankle support and this is not uncommon.

 

Thegn Teigr and I squaring off at a demo.  I'm behind the kite shield.

 

 

 

summer_fun_zps1a69e404.jpg

 

 

Both of us wear similar height boots though his are much more SCA and mine are a little more goth club.

 

When I'm not in armor, I wear simple Jorvik boots, though mine aren't as tall.  Since they have no ankle or foot support, they are a little odd at first but it's a bit like walking barefoot without having to worry about thorns or sharp stones.  In fact, mine have the outline of my foot and my individual toes on the out underside of the sole.  I wrap my ankles and lower legs with winningas and this adds a bit of support but it still goes without saying that this is not something I was physically used to.

0001256_jorvik_viking_boots_zps4a6c3b71.

 

Period footwear in the SCA is hard to do (not to mention expensive; for something so simple, those Jorviks cost $80) but there are ways around that if you know what to look for.  A lot of times, the women I know will wear slippers or ballet flats beneath their skirts.  Most guys when they start out will wear hiking boots or army boots - it's a little unusual at court but makes perfect sense when you're fighting. Women have it a lot easier right now since the mundane fashion markets are _flooded_ with knee high boots in a simple cut. If you went to an event in something like this or this, nobody would bat an eye. If you spend some time learning about period footwear, you'll start to recognize patterns and similarities in modern footwear. With a few exceptions, our physiology hasn't changed too much over the past thousand years.

 

http://www.garbtheworld.com/items/periodshoes.shtml - These guys have a good selection of period shoes.

 

Boots by Bohemond has some swell stuff - http://bootsbybohemond.net/

And I keep mentioning Renstore but never linking them - http://stores.renstore.com/ They have a few footwear options but you can also find decent garb there.

 

I have a list of Etsy vendors that I can scour and pass along a few options.

Edited by Wren of the Brown
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Hooray for good seamstress friends! (I would be in nothing but t-tunics without them.) :biggrin: 

 

Rasheta, to answer your question regarding clothing (at least as far as patterns) may I recommend: http://garbindex.com/  Which appears to have patterns and articles on many different types of clothing ,several of which are fairly simple to make, and easily customize-able for size as some of them start with "take your own measurements." :smile: I've made a lot of very easy 'two large seam' dresses using the basic tunic pattern, cut to me, that only take about 2-3 hours. 

 

If you're wanting more modern patterns (for the sake of sewing), there are actually several professional patterns in fabric stores by the pattern companies that are perfectly acceptable (especially the historical series) as long as you use good fabrics and avoid modern-looking trims. 

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So. Wenching. It happened.

 

 

 

10480162_722595194477700_540953118_n_zps

 

 

 

A few people from our Shire and across the Kingdom asked to see my twin sister more often. >_>

I couldn't help it  since we are talking Wenching 

 

 

 

 

Lor I don't drive and with my mental health I couldn't do it on my own. So sadly till I find a friend willing to go into it with me I can't. *sad face* till then I'll go to the faire or something. :) 

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