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Week 1: Moridin vs. Aviendha


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Poll: Week 1: Moridin vs. Aviendha (295 member(s) have cast votes)

Who will win?

  1. Moridin (210 votes [71.19%])

    Percentage of vote: 71.19%

  2. Aviendha (85 votes [28.81%])

    Percentage of vote: 28.81%

Vote

#21 Dream

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 06:41 AM

Good grief! Avi over Moridin? Rand shouldn't even bother to show up for the Last Battle.

#22 FossMaNo1

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 08:32 AM

Yeah, I gotta say I don't buy Aviendha winning this one.. Morridin is way too...good at what he does. I really like the narrative, but I don't see Morridin getting close enough to allow her to use the knife. Still, he did go weapon on weapon with Rand once...

#23 Ledinna Sedai

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 09:10 AM

I absolutely adore Aviendha, but to be honest, I agree that she couldn't win Moridin.
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#24 XXX47

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 09:10 AM

No chance..whatever angreal Avi has. Knowledge is power and Moridin has more knowledge that even Rand/LTT (TP skill for instance). Even Rand will struggle to beat Moridin..Avi will get swatted like a fly.

#25 Nightstrike

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 11:03 AM

True Power is probably an advantage in a real duel. Unless both go for Balefire, then it would probably be the quickest of them that wins. I think both are very quick. Moridin probably has no objection to using Balefire, but I think Aviendha might hesitate to use it.

Edited by Nightstrike, 16 January 2012 - 11:08 AM.


#26 avernite

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 12:27 PM

For a time she was consumed by the pain. It went beyond anything she had ever felt; beyond even what Lanfear had wrought upon her. To even scream was lost to her. She wanted to give up.


Up to this point I agree with the write up. I just suspect this level of pain would lead to passing out even for an Aiel. Their tricks are about ignoring the fact it hurts bad, it's not about mitigating the actual physical effects. Aviendha passes out from pain, gets 13x13'ed, misery happens ;)

#27 gwenifer

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 02:57 PM

I like the write-up too, but it would be lame if Moridin lost. He is a match for Rand, and could Avi win with Rand? Nope...

I just hope that aMoL will be much more satisfying than "Merlin" finale...


#28 Didgya

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 03:24 PM

Hate to say it but Moridin for the win. :unsure: I was unsure until someone reminded me of the True power and that would be that. :ohmy:
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#29 Owayn The Traveller

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 05:13 PM

Moridin would be wary of third agers. His encounters with Rand would do that and wasn't he shocked by Avi before when she untangled the gateway

So any element of surprise or underestimating her could be ruled out.
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#30 New Ashaman

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 05:30 PM

True Source. Mordin wins

#31 New Ashaman

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 05:31 PM

moridin

#32 Turin Turambar

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Posted 16 January 2012 - 09:18 PM

Moridin is supposed to be on par with LTT inn terms of skill plus he has access to the True Power as Naeblis. Only Evil is dumb gives Avi any chance. Not enough for me to pick her however.

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#33 snowball

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Posted 17 January 2012 - 05:08 AM

Yeah, I gotta say I don't buy Aviendha winning this one.. Morridin is way too...good at what he does. I really like the narrative, but I don't see Morridin getting close enough to allow her to use the knife. Still, he did go weapon on weapon with Rand once...



Actually, its three times, end of EotW, the scene in the middle of tGH when Rand gets his heron brands, and the battle at Falme. all of these are basically melee fights (or glorified sword fights), because Rand has no real grasp on channeling up to this point. Keep in mind that Rand had very recently killed Turak, once he was able to obtain the void. He is at least holding the source during the Ishy duel in the sky, so his skills are at least passable. I guess the point would be that Ishy was no joke in a scuffle either. Don't see any situation where Avi would be a match.

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#34 g o i

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Posted 17 January 2012 - 12:40 PM

one mordin's monologes are for rand in fact they almost will have to meet up just after the meating between rand and the WT. so he has enough time to say all his monologues
2. does aviendha know balefire if not well you know what that means
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#35 Verbal32

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Posted 17 January 2012 - 02:50 PM

Taim losing! Moridin losing! WTF! What's next Rand losing to Noel?


Crap....so much for my next write-up. Back to the drawing board.....

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#36 Crusader12

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Posted 17 January 2012 - 02:50 PM

You're forgetting that the levels are very specifically not linear. They're just the general grouping of power. I think that once you get into the higher ranges the differences would be much bigger than in the lower ranges, like each level being a multiple of the previous instead of added to it. You can easily see this in comparing two clearly established measurements of strength, how much channelers can lift. Siuan (lvl 12) is said to have been able to lift three times her weight or something like that. Morgase struggles to lift up a handkerchief. Now, either the handkerchief weighed about 30 pounds, or a level 1 is much less than 1/12 as strong as a level 12.


Actually Morgase could easily lift the handkerchief provided she could touch saidar. It was the touching saidar that she struggled with--when she had it, the handkerchief went taut, when she lost it, it fell. The weight was no issue.

From there I've seen no evidence that strength is staggered between the levels--indeed, when I asked Maria if the bell curve of strength fell in an even distribution, she said yes. Of course there are other situations where strength effects function--as with lifting--like the weavings of gateways, but we know for a fact that in these incidences the strength is not directly proportional to the effect--specifically, yes strength will decide the size of the gateway, but the size is not directly proportional to the strength used to weave it. So, Rand as the strongest male channeler makes the largest gateways--four feet by four feet--but it does not take him all of his strength to weave a gateway of that size. Indeed, during the attack on Algarin's manor he is doing a great many things, yet Logain states clearly that his gateways--though not formed with his full strength--are full sized. By the same note, a gateway woven by a cross-gender link is larger than a gateway woven at the same strength by a man or a woman or a circle of women.

This clearly shows that there is a different relationship between strength and function than the directly proportional one that you are inferring. Another example is the division of flows--again, an ability decided in some way by the channelers strength, yet as shown by Egwene under forkroot, not a result of direct strength correlation.

The two are inter-related, but not cause and effect. As such disproportionate differences between what the strength levels can achieve is not indicative of there being disproportionate increases in strength between the levels.


In FoH, when Rand is asking Asmodean questions about the OP, he recalls the time that "he had tested himself against [Elayne and Egwene], and later Elayne had confessed that she felt like a kitten seized by a mastiff." While the girls were certainly nowhere near their full strength at the time, neither was Rand, and he was splitting his flows to confront both of them simultaneously. A kitten seized by a mastiff is a pretty strong analogy, so I'd say that the jumps between levels of power on that scale would have to be non-linear as was proposed here, or how could 2 of the most powerful female channelers in the last 1000 years, working together against a single male, feel so totally overwhelmed?

#37 ShowMeYourRage

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Posted 17 January 2012 - 04:05 PM

Long time lurker, first time poster.

Much as I think these cage matches are entertaining, it feels like Suvudu, in that it seems to be as much a popularity contest as it is a realistic match.

Aviendha having an angreal means nothing. At the Cleansing Alivia was armed with an angreal and was stronger than Lanfear, yet weakened as she was, Cyndane still was the victor due to knowledge and skill. Aviendha hasnt the skill of Cyndane or even Alivia, and Moridin has as much skill as anyone. Even with her angreal, I still do not think Avi would be on par with Rand and Moridin. Plus, if we assume Avi had access to that angreal, then we should take into account whatever stash of goodies Moridin has, which he does have, judging from the Dreamspikes. For what its worth, I do not think Moridin would even waste time talking to her before skinning her. If he knew she was Rands lover as the opening post suggested, she would be dead before she even knew she should fight.
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#38 78WARLOCK

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Posted 17 January 2012 - 06:01 PM

Aviendha. After pasing through the columns again and seeing the Aiels' possible future. The will to save her people alone would allow her victory.
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#39 kraefzke

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Posted 18 January 2012 - 04:35 AM

Loved the write-up, voted for Moridin anyway, think it's way more likely. Small criticism: It disturbed me that both Taim and Moridin should lose because of forgetting about "normal" weapons (yes, I know, those two write-ups were written by different people, but anyway). I could buy it with Taim, but Moridin would imo never act so stupid. IF Avi were to win this, might I suggest a scenario were he doesn't hold onto the shield with his full strength due to underestimating her, and she somehow figures out how to break through the shield (for which one must be willing to accept pain, which she of course "embraces"). Would have liked that better....

#40 thevondy

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Posted 18 January 2012 - 10:10 AM

I'm sorry but Moridin could do what ever he wanted with Avi in this matchup. She would never stand a change.