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How tall is the White Tower?


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#1 Tyzack

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 11:43 AM

In terms of stories/meters/feet/etc...is it's height known?

Also, the "topless towers of cairhien" are these topless b/c they are unfinished, or are they semi-sky-scrappers?

That is all.

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#2 BelRobin

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 02:05 PM

all i know for sure is that egwene was fighting
on the 43rd level in TOM.

#3 FossMaNo1

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 04:19 PM

So, that's about 516 ft (12ft per floor)? To put that in perspective, the Eiffel Tower is 1,063 ft.

#4 Suttree

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 04:21 PM

Think I remember reading it is 100 spans in height...

Edited by Suttree, 29 November 2011 - 04:21 PM.

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#5 Durinax

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 04:54 PM

uhm the topless towers are named that becasue their reconstruction isnt finished since the Aiel burned them
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#6 Thrasymachus

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 10:53 PM

Think I remember reading it is 100 spans in height...

That wouldn't be very impressive since a span is only 8 inches. The White Tower would be only 75 feet tall. Maybe 1000 spans?

Nope, went and looked it up on the wiki. In the WoT universe, 10 inches is 1 foot. 3 feet is one pace and two paces is one span. So one span is 60 inches, 100 spans would be 6000 inches, or 500 feet in real-world feet. If it had 12 foot stories, it could only have 41, which I think makes it likely that it averaged 10 foot stories. To put that in some perspective, the Statue of Liberty is 305 feet, including the base, the UN Headquarters building in New York is 505 feet, the Saint Louis Arch is 630 feet, the Seattle Space Needle is 605 feet, and the Eiffel Tower is 1,056 feet if you count the TV tower on the top, 984 feet if you don't. So the White Tower is about half as tall as the Eiffel Tower, slightly shorter than the Arch or the Space Needle, and about the same size as the UN Headquarter's building. Whatever else you may find similar between the White Tower and the UN, I never expected their buildings to be the same size.

Edited by Thrasymachus, 29 November 2011 - 10:57 PM.


#7 Arkane101

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Posted 29 November 2011 - 11:29 PM

i'd imagine it would be a bit hard to make a building 1000+ feet in randland, without vehicles that can reach up like they do in the real world. That said, The topless towers aren't called the topless towers because they are not finished, it is because they are "semi-sky-scrappers." I have two references: "The Topless Towers of Cairhien," Loial murmured sadly. "Well, they were tall enough to warrant the name, once. When the Aiel took Cairhien, about the time you were born, the towers burned, and cracked, and fell." The Great Hunt, Cairhien, and http://wot.wikia.com.../Topless_Towers

Edited by Arkane101, 29 November 2011 - 11:30 PM.


#8 Thrasymachus

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 01:34 AM

Considering the tallest masonry structure in the world today is only about 550 feet tall (the Philadelphia City Hall), it seems unlikely the Topless Towers are actually taller than the White Tower. Unless they're sneaking some steel and concrete into the construction. They may have been designed to be, but not by much, and they are unfinished, after all. It's probably more likely the Topless Towers are between 300 and 450 feet tall.

#9 FarShainMael

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 02:32 AM

i'd imagine it would be a bit hard to make a building 1000+ feet in randland,


Not when you're using the One Power.

Also, from the Guinness World Records:

"The tallest building is the Burj Khalifa (Khalifa Tower) which measures 828 m (2,716 ft 6 in) tall... officially opened in Dubai, UAE, on 4 January 2010."

http://www.guinnessw...llest-building/

Edited by FarShainMael, 30 November 2011 - 02:37 AM.

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#10 Testy al'Carr

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 03:37 AM


i'd imagine it would be a bit hard to make a building 1000+ feet in randland,


Not when you're using the One Power.

Also, from the Guinness World Records:

"The tallest building is the Burj Khalifa (Khalifa Tower) which measures 828 m (2,716 ft 6 in) tall... officially opened in Dubai, UAE, on 4 January 2010."

http://www.guinnessw...llest-building/

he was talking about a pure masonry structure, sans steel reinforcement. and even 500 feet for a building as the white tower is described would be amazing to behold. but with the one power put into it, 500 seems a little small.


EDIT: didn't edit my input, just added to it, not sure why i said someone was talking about a pure masonry structure, i got that from reading comments to this point and missed who was being replied to at this point. if there is one thing i know how to do, it is how to make a mess.

Edited by Testy al'Carr, 30 November 2011 - 03:47 AM.

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#11 Testy al'Carr

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 03:43 AM

an interesting thought though, that it might be around the same height as the un building in nyc.
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#12 Tyzack

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 05:23 AM

Whatever else you may find similar between the White Tower and the UN, I never expected their buildings to be the same size.


Hahahahahhaa....

And, as a side note, for anyone who hasn't seen the Burj, it is almost unbelievably tall. It dominates (almost doubles) a sky line of 90+ story buildings, and is quiet majestic when seen from around the base.

Ex:
Attached File  Picture 002-small.jpg   56.97KB   68 downloads
Attached File  Pictures from trip so far 014-small.jpg   71.17KB   67 downloads

Fleigt heim, ihr Raben!

Mandrake, in the name of her majesty and the continental congress, get over here and feed me this belt!

"If you are losing faith in human nature, go out and watch a marathon"
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"Bet on it!"

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#13 Thrasymachus

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 06:39 AM

Well, see, that's the thing. I don't think there's any evidence to suppose that any part of the Topless Towers were constructed by the Power, and whatever construction technology survived the Breaking appears to be at roughly early Renaissance levels during Rand's time, so no steel beam and concrete reinforcing. Even with the White Tower, it appears that they used the Power in constructing it less to over-top some maximum practical height in a stone tower and more so they could use less materials in reaching that height. The walls of the Philadelphia City Hall, for example, already mentioned as the world's tallest purely masonry structure, are 22 feet thick at their base in order to support that height. I imagine using the Power allowed them to use walls at the base that were much less thick, not to mention hardening the surface to protect against erosion. A 3000 year old tower made of natural stone would look more like a pile of rocks after all that weathering than a man-made structure. They may have been able to build the White Tower higher, but at 500 feet, they're already nearly at the maximum of any normal stone tower anyway, pretty much ensuring that nobody could build a taller one, so no real sense in or need to build it any taller than that.

#14 mandersen

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:57 AM

We keep bringing up the topless towers as if that's the next tallest. But didn't Noal say (somewhere in KoD) that the 7 towers of Malkier were taller than the topless towers (which, btw, sounds like an establishment that could be found in Vegas)? Mat thinks Noal tends to exaggerate, but that's probably just because he's seen so many strange things.

#15 Tyzack

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 08:20 AM

We keep bringing up the topless towers as if that's the next tallest. But didn't Noal say (somewhere in KoD) that the 7 towers of Malkier were taller than the topless towers (which, btw, sounds like an establishment that could be found in Vegas)? Mat thinks Noal tends to exaggerate, but that's probably just because he's seen so many strange things.


I brought up the "topless towers" because in FoH when (i forget whose PoV it is) is describing them as "impossibly tall"

Fleigt heim, ihr Raben!

Mandrake, in the name of her majesty and the continental congress, get over here and feed me this belt!

"If you are losing faith in human nature, go out and watch a marathon"
-Kathrine Switzer

 

"Bet on it!"

-President Barrak Obama 


#16 Agitel

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 10:41 AM


We keep bringing up the topless towers as if that's the next tallest. But didn't Noal say (somewhere in KoD) that the 7 towers of Malkier were taller than the topless towers (which, btw, sounds like an establishment that could be found in Vegas)? Mat thinks Noal tends to exaggerate, but that's probably just because he's seen so many strange things.


I brought up the "topless towers" because in FoH when (i forget whose PoV it is) is describing them as "impossibly tall"


You have to keep the setting (time period and technology) in mind when you read those descriptions, though.

Also, in the 10 inches per foot, three feet per pace, two paces per span thing, what is the unit that matches up to our modern units of the same name? This topic used the inch, but for some reason I'm thinking it's the foot. Mat's described as being two inches under six feet, or maybe it was Perrin as being two inches over. If the inch was the common standard, then Mat would be four feet and ten inches tall in the real world, and Perrin would be five feet and two inches tall. That would mean that me, as short as I am (5'5" or 65 inches) would be three inches taller than Perrin and the same height as Rand. I don't think so.

That just doesn't seem right to me.

So, treating the foot as the common standard between our two measuring systems, the White Tower would be about six hundred feet tall.

Also, a lot of credit is being given to the use of the One Power in the construction, but we're leaving out Ogier masonry, which likely surpasses real world masonry skills.

Edited by Agitel, 30 November 2011 - 10:48 AM.


#17 Thrasymachus

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 02:52 PM



We keep bringing up the topless towers as if that's the next tallest. But didn't Noal say (somewhere in KoD) that the 7 towers of Malkier were taller than the topless towers (which, btw, sounds like an establishment that could be found in Vegas)? Mat thinks Noal tends to exaggerate, but that's probably just because he's seen so many strange things.


I brought up the "topless towers" because in FoH when (i forget whose PoV it is) is describing them as "impossibly tall"


You have to keep the setting (time period and technology) in mind when you read those descriptions, though.

Also, in the 10 inches per foot, three feet per pace, two paces per span thing, what is the unit that matches up to our modern units of the same name? This topic used the inch, but for some reason I'm thinking it's the foot. Mat's described as being two inches under six feet, or maybe it was Perrin as being two inches over. If the inch was the common standard, then Mat would be four feet and ten inches tall in the real world, and Perrin would be five feet and two inches tall. That would mean that me, as short as I am (5'5" or 65 inches) would be three inches taller than Perrin and the same height as Rand. I don't think so.

That just doesn't seem right to me.

So, treating the foot as the common standard between our two measuring systems, the White Tower would be about six hundred feet tall.

Also, a lot of credit is being given to the use of the One Power in the construction, but we're leaving out Ogier masonry, which likely surpasses real world masonry skills.


That's a pretty good argument that it's the foot measurement and not the inch that's the closest between our world and Randland. I'd be willing to buy that the White Tower is about 50 feet taller than the tallest purely masonry load-bearing structure in the real world, and is able to attain that height in an era of low technology primarily through use of the Power, and ogier stonemasonry, of course, but I doubt even ogier craftsmanship can overcome the inherent compression strength of stone, brick, mortar and wood.

#18 Entreri

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 04:52 PM

With carbon nanotubes, 10,000 feet structures are not far off.

It is impressive that these primitives are able to create a structure 500 feet.

#19 BelRobin

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 05:07 PM

will someone please answer this question.
its starting to bug me now.damn.

Edited by BelRobin, 30 November 2011 - 05:08 PM.


#20 Suttree

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Posted 30 November 2011 - 07:25 PM

According to WoT measurements I've found online, 1 span=6 feet, 10"=1foot. So the WT would be about 500 feet tall in our world as stated above.

Edited by Suttree, 30 November 2011 - 07:34 PM.

Waves are the ultimate illusion. They come out of nowhere, instantaneously materialize, and just as quickly they break and vanish. Chasing after such fleeting mirages is a complete wast of time. That is what I choose to do with my life." - Miki Dora